Recently on Revolt-World, Skitch presented his new track as a Stock-like track: https://www.revoltworld.net/dl/s4-2/
To which a commentator replied: "I always enjoy stock-like visuals, but this one doesn’t quite fully meet those standards for me though."
I admit that I don't really understand what makes a track stocklike or not.
So, what criteria make a track ‘stock like’ in your opinion?
Stocklike Track ?
Re: Stocklike Track ?
Maybe the usage of stock-like textures and/or shapes?
Stock-likeness sounds like it "meets the standards of a stock track" rather than being a throw-up.
That's all I have to say. Cheers!
Stock-likeness sounds like it "meets the standards of a stock track" rather than being a throw-up.
That's all I have to say. Cheers!
Re: Stocklike Track ?
Oh, cool to hear there's a new Skitch2 track!
I haven't had much time for Re-Volt lately, and also got demotivated by the loss of RVZ's content (and so far no success of securing XTG, which might meet the same fate at some point). I'm looking forward to checking it out, though.
In general, I do find the term 'stock-like' strange for modern tracks, as these days, the quality of good tracks is generally above those of the original game, at least in terms of graphics. However, a track might of course be purposefully made to have a similar aesthetic to the tracks from the original game.
I haven't had much time for Re-Volt lately, and also got demotivated by the loss of RVZ's content (and so far no success of securing XTG, which might meet the same fate at some point). I'm looking forward to checking it out, though.
In general, I do find the term 'stock-like' strange for modern tracks, as these days, the quality of good tracks is generally above those of the original game, at least in terms of graphics. However, a track might of course be purposefully made to have a similar aesthetic to the tracks from the original game.
Re: Stocklike Track ?
Yes 607, I quite agree with you.
Let us take two recent examples: Office1 by L17 and Crystal Caves by Keeller Wheel.
Office is claimed by its creator to be a stock-like track, and in my opinion, there is no doubt that it is indeed one.
Just like Kiwi's School's Out!, for example. Except that School's Out, unlike Office, is teeming with details. There are so many that, in my opinion, it strays from the original spirit found in Office.
There is very little detail in Crystal Caves, which is a track that I would not describe as Stock-Like. But on reflection, what makes me say that? I think it's due to its very smooth trajectory. Not something you usually see in original tracks.
So, could the term ‘stock like’ be a way of saying that we don't want in our creation to exceed the limits of the game (and early 2000s PCs)? And if we agree to go beyond these limits, to what extent?
If anyone has a definition, I'm curious to read it.
Let us take two recent examples: Office1 by L17 and Crystal Caves by Keeller Wheel.
Office is claimed by its creator to be a stock-like track, and in my opinion, there is no doubt that it is indeed one.
Just like Kiwi's School's Out!, for example. Except that School's Out, unlike Office, is teeming with details. There are so many that, in my opinion, it strays from the original spirit found in Office.
There is very little detail in Crystal Caves, which is a track that I would not describe as Stock-Like. But on reflection, what makes me say that? I think it's due to its very smooth trajectory. Not something you usually see in original tracks.
So, could the term ‘stock like’ be a way of saying that we don't want in our creation to exceed the limits of the game (and early 2000s PCs)? And if we agree to go beyond these limits, to what extent?
If anyone has a definition, I'm curious to read it.
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ZipperZbieracz
- Posts: 318
Re: Stocklike Track ?
To determine what makes a stocklike track, we need to dissect what makes a track in the first place and what differentiates various track types, like stock, custom [extreme] and lego, and what differentiates simple from complex tracks - as complex modern tracks naturally don't fit into stocklike category, and neither do lego as it's a different thing altogether.
On the spot, I can come up with a few things. Track geometry. Track raceline complexity. The amount and complexity of decorative objects. Texture quality, texture resolution and texture variability. Sound effects.
Track geometry - stock tracks usually have sharp corners, sharper entrances to ramps, clearly defined edges. The "racing" surface is usually always flat with little variability in height, there are no small "bumps", indentations/cavities are rare and occasional (like dirt with cauliflowers in hood2 near the wall, where the racing line is on grass, or how the road in hood1 is slightly bent) and mostly away from the racing surface (think water ponds in Garden), they serve more as a decorative and "racing area restrictors", unless you end up there from a shockwave.
Track raceline complexity - raceline on stock tracks isn't constantly riddled with numerous small objects, instances and immovable obstacles. The hardest stock track - mus1 - has tables, dinosaur skeletons and rope posts (idk how to call them). As for objects, there are bottles and milk cartons. Immovable obstacles like washing detergents are placed on the shelves, they don't act as obstacles to avoid. Chairs and sunbeds on tt1 are easily seen from afar. Not a trivial amount of turns can be taken flat-out against the wall, even if it is sometimes slower, but the track geometry allows for it, because there are vertical walls that follow the turns as well. Most difficulty on the tracks stem from the combination of simple turns, chicanes, ramps and occasional obstacles (chair, table, dinosaur) or track geometry (river part in hood2, garden bent turns) as well as some basic variability in track surfaces, not from the sole amount of tricky and behind-the-corner obstacles or jumps you need to slow down for or you miss the corner (there are basically no such jumps on stocks).
Decorative objects - fairly limited on stock tracks. Dog feeder in hood2, chairs and tables, dinosaurs, full-size cars, detergents, a flying rc-copter. As for movable objects - milk cartons, shopping cart, bottles, ABC blocks, basket ball, beach ball. Plants/bushes have no collision. So the tracks are decorated by a moderate mix of track geometry, objects, instances and extra geometry features, all while keeping the racing line relatively clean.
Textures - I'm not too good with flat objects and textures, but the stock Re-Volt textures are "simple", and very repetitive in their pattern that is laid across the entire given surface. The textures aren't heavily detailed, on a stock track you won't see a poster or a board. Textures are not animated. As for colour palette and the overall aesthetic - idk what to say about it.
Sound effects - laser beams, kids shouting in the hood, laser detection alarm, rocking horse, cock, clock, lights on-off, dinosaur fire breath, helicopter sound etc. There are ambient sound effects, but it's not overwhelming, and obviously "custom" sounds that do not appear anywhere on any stock track on a custom track are automatically becoming "non-stock" sounds effects.
So taking all into consideration, I would say that the #1 thing that makes a custom track "stocklike" is the racing line and raceline geometry as I detailed above – mostly flat racing surface and simple track & raceline geometry, and in #2 come the visual and aesthetic aspects of the track which can't be too complex and overly detailed and mostly kept out of the racing path.
On the spot, I can come up with a few things. Track geometry. Track raceline complexity. The amount and complexity of decorative objects. Texture quality, texture resolution and texture variability. Sound effects.
Track geometry - stock tracks usually have sharp corners, sharper entrances to ramps, clearly defined edges. The "racing" surface is usually always flat with little variability in height, there are no small "bumps", indentations/cavities are rare and occasional (like dirt with cauliflowers in hood2 near the wall, where the racing line is on grass, or how the road in hood1 is slightly bent) and mostly away from the racing surface (think water ponds in Garden), they serve more as a decorative and "racing area restrictors", unless you end up there from a shockwave.
Track raceline complexity - raceline on stock tracks isn't constantly riddled with numerous small objects, instances and immovable obstacles. The hardest stock track - mus1 - has tables, dinosaur skeletons and rope posts (idk how to call them). As for objects, there are bottles and milk cartons. Immovable obstacles like washing detergents are placed on the shelves, they don't act as obstacles to avoid. Chairs and sunbeds on tt1 are easily seen from afar. Not a trivial amount of turns can be taken flat-out against the wall, even if it is sometimes slower, but the track geometry allows for it, because there are vertical walls that follow the turns as well. Most difficulty on the tracks stem from the combination of simple turns, chicanes, ramps and occasional obstacles (chair, table, dinosaur) or track geometry (river part in hood2, garden bent turns) as well as some basic variability in track surfaces, not from the sole amount of tricky and behind-the-corner obstacles or jumps you need to slow down for or you miss the corner (there are basically no such jumps on stocks).
Decorative objects - fairly limited on stock tracks. Dog feeder in hood2, chairs and tables, dinosaurs, full-size cars, detergents, a flying rc-copter. As for movable objects - milk cartons, shopping cart, bottles, ABC blocks, basket ball, beach ball. Plants/bushes have no collision. So the tracks are decorated by a moderate mix of track geometry, objects, instances and extra geometry features, all while keeping the racing line relatively clean.
Textures - I'm not too good with flat objects and textures, but the stock Re-Volt textures are "simple", and very repetitive in their pattern that is laid across the entire given surface. The textures aren't heavily detailed, on a stock track you won't see a poster or a board. Textures are not animated. As for colour palette and the overall aesthetic - idk what to say about it.
Sound effects - laser beams, kids shouting in the hood, laser detection alarm, rocking horse, cock, clock, lights on-off, dinosaur fire breath, helicopter sound etc. There are ambient sound effects, but it's not overwhelming, and obviously "custom" sounds that do not appear anywhere on any stock track on a custom track are automatically becoming "non-stock" sounds effects.
So taking all into consideration, I would say that the #1 thing that makes a custom track "stocklike" is the racing line and raceline geometry as I detailed above – mostly flat racing surface and simple track & raceline geometry, and in #2 come the visual and aesthetic aspects of the track which can't be too complex and overly detailed and mostly kept out of the racing path.
Re: Stocklike Track ?
Thx Zipperzbieracz for this detailed explanation!
I think your point of view is correct and that it can sometimes be difficult to classify a track as a stock track simply because certain criteria are not always met.
I think your point of view is correct and that it can sometimes be difficult to classify a track as a stock track simply because certain criteria are not always met.